Star Wars Episode IX - The Rise of Skywalker (2019)

All non-Nolan related film, tv, and streaming discussions.
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Master Virgo wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 2:07 pm
ArmandFancypants wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 11:47 am
Master Virgo wrote:
December 29th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Honouring Luke and Anakin on Tatooine is like honouring Harry Potter on 4
Private Drive. It's a damning place that they always wanted to get away from. It's somewhere that they suffered great tragedies, and their life only really started when they left that cursed planet. It's as if someone honours Rey on Jakku after her death.

But of course who cares about what makes sense fot the characters. Nostalgia for Star Wars fans, is all that matters.
I think the film is a mess, but I really don't agree with this.
Part of the power of both faith and pilgrimage in particular is that it is transformative. It can and does elevate what was mundane into something immensely powerful. That is the magic of it, and the importance of it: that the site of tragedy and then humble, mundane existence can become a place of power and universal importance.

This is more ham-fisted of course than the broomboy coda, but it speaks to the same ideas of the ordinary becoming extraordinary.

If Harry Potter was a history and if Rowling had any concept of a mythic scope and any of these kinds of ideas then yes, 4 Privet Drive would get a blue plaque and would be a place of pilgrimage. Because that's the cradle of the person's values and what makes them them. Harry is a good person because he has an exemplar to rail against. Luke is a good person because he was raised by good people, even if he hated that life. These characters don't come to us as a blank, impressionable canvas who might be pushed this way and that (unlike, well, Anakin).
The appropriate way to pay tribute to people, is to do it on a place where they made their greatest accomplishment, a place of catharsis, where they put their hearts and souls to achieve greatness for themselves and others.

Dumbledore was rightfully honoured in Hogwarts, not his childhood home where he always blamed himself for the death of his sister and a place where tragedies tore apart his family.

For Luke that has to be Crait, but that is not a place that some portion of Star Wars fans would ever want to revisit. So they go somewhere that everybody remember fondly due to nostalgia.
It's in the same vein as Leia and Han naming their son, Ben. Who the hell is Ben? It's an alias used by Obi-Wan so he can survive during the reign of Empire. It's not even the name Leia knew him by.

Obi-Wan Kenobi was a legend, the great hero of the republic and the Jedi. Ben Kenobi is a defeated old man living the remainder of his life in exile alone. It's as if Samwise names his son, Strider, because it's the name they initially knew Aragorn by. But he was Strider when he was small and insignificant, a vagabond in the woods who is belittled by the locales and not taken seriously. What kind of honouring would that be?

But Ben is Obi-Wan's name exclusively used in OT, while the name, Obi-Wan has been somewhat polluted by the memory of Prequels. And that mindset would repeatedly take priority over what appears to be the best for the characters and the story throughout Abrams' two outings in ST.
If this is all true, why did Rian Johnson write a twin suns sequence into Luke’s death on Crait in The Last Jedi?

It’s pretty disingenuous to act like Tatooine’s twin suns is a valid emotional send-off in one and not the other.

-Vader

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Twin suns is not about Tatooine or some fondness or love Luke has for it. On the contrary, it's a defining image for Luke as a character that showcases his desire to break free of the shackles that have chained him to a place of stillness. To fly to places that he has never known. Somewhere out there is where his heart belongs to.

It's a sign that he was born for great things and adventures beyond the small and insignificant planet that he was placed at as a child. Tattooine does not define Luke, it's where he starts and where he moves on from.

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Master Virgo wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 3:02 pm
Twin suns is not about Tatooine or some fondness or love Luke has for it. On the contrary, it's a defining image for Luke as a character that showcases his desire to break free of the shackles that have chained him to a place of stillness. To fly to places that he has never known. Somewhere out there is where his heart belongs to.

It's a sign that he was born for great things and adventures beyond the small and insignificant planet that he was placed at as a child. Tattooine does not define Luke, it's where he starts and where he moves on from.
Amen to that!

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Boyega seems to be drunk on twitter right now.

Gross comment after comment on Finn-Poe and Finn-Rey. Just embarrasing to watch.

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m4st4 wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 4:31 pm
Boyega seems to be drunk on twitter right now.

Gross comment after comment on Finn-Poe and Finn-Rey. Just embarrasing to watch.
He’s making fun of Reylos and calling fans idiots. LMAO!

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Twitter is bad.

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Ben Shapiro@benshapiro

Just saw "Rise of Skywalker." Everyone is wrong. The movie is mostly nostalgia-packed joy. If you love the original "Star Wars," you should be grateful to JJ Abrams for attempting to right his own wrongs in "Force Awakens" and the travesty that is "Last Jedi."

Ben Shapiro@benshapiro

Finn and Poe remain boring and irrelevant. But Kylo Ren is given an actual arc, and Rey's reveal is pretty great -- and answers the key "Mary Sue" question about her. The nasty endings for Han and Luke are bought back, and Leia is given some great backstory and a solid ending.

Ben Shapiro@benshapiro

Basically, if you were pissed at what they did in "Force Awakens" and "Last Jedi" to all your favorite childhood characters, they tried to undo it in "Rise of Skywalker." And that is great.
Peter Scrietta retweeted this as an endorsement. He's been embarrassingly defensive over this movie. He has now resorted to this. All respect gone. Just embarrassing.

JJ made a troll/deplorable friendly movie.

Wow...just rewatched The Last Jedi and it made me realize what a massive turd Rise of Skywalker is.

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Master Virgo wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 2:07 pm
ArmandFancypants wrote:
December 31st, 2019, 11:47 am
Master Virgo wrote:
December 29th, 2019, 12:36 pm
Honouring Luke and Anakin on Tatooine is like honouring Harry Potter on 4
Private Drive. It's a damning place that they always wanted to get away from. It's somewhere that they suffered great tragedies, and their life only really started when they left that cursed planet. It's as if someone honours Rey on Jakku after her death.

But of course who cares about what makes sense fot the characters. Nostalgia for Star Wars fans, is all that matters.
I think the film is a mess, but I really don't agree with this.
Part of the power of both faith and pilgrimage in particular is that it is transformative. It can and does elevate what was mundane into something immensely powerful. That is the magic of it, and the importance of it: that the site of tragedy and then humble, mundane existence can become a place of power and universal importance.

This is more ham-fisted of course than the broomboy coda, but it speaks to the same ideas of the ordinary becoming extraordinary.

If Harry Potter was a history and if Rowling had any concept of a mythic scope and any of these kinds of ideas then yes, 4 Privet Drive would get a blue plaque and would be a place of pilgrimage. Because that's the cradle of the person's values and what makes them them. Harry is a good person because he has an exemplar to rail against. Luke is a good person because he was raised by good people, even if he hated that life. These characters don't come to us as a blank, impressionable canvas who might be pushed this way and that (unlike, well, Anakin).
The appropriate way to pay tribute to people, is to do it on a place where they made their greatest accomplishment, a place of catharsis, where they put their hearts and souls to achieve greatness for themselves and others.

Dumbledore was rightfully honoured in Hogwarts, not his childhood home where he always blamed himself for the death of his sister and a place where tragedies tore apart his family.

For Luke that has to be Crait, but that is not a place that some portion of Star Wars fans would ever want to revisit. So they go somewhere that everybody remember fondly due to nostalgia.
It's in the same vein as Leia and Han naming their son, Ben. Who the hell is Ben? It's an alias used by Obi-Wan so he can survive during the reign of Empire. It's not even the name Leia knew him by.

Obi-Wan Kenobi was a legend, the great hero of the republic and the Jedi. Ben Kenobi is a defeated old man living the remainder of his life in exile alone. It's as if Samwise names his son, Strider, because it's the name they initially knew Aragorn by. But he was Strider when he was small and insignificant, a vagabond in the woods who is belittled by the locales and not taken seriously. What kind of honouring would that be?

But Ben is Obi-Wan's name exclusively used in OT, while the name, Obi-Wan has been somewhat polluted by the memory of Prequels. And that mindset would repeatedly take priority over what appears to be the best for the characters and the story throughout Abrams' two outings in ST.
This, again, is not how pilgrimage or faith works. When the life is all that is left, the places of significance are all of equal importance, rather than the places of greatest triumph. How extraordinary it would be, I would argue, to commemorate Crait - the place of Leia's grim defeat, and a place that Luke never visited? But it is still significant of course, as is the Lars homestead.

I would pump the brakes on using Potter as an example because I think Rowling's concept of scope and the ability to transcend to some sort of mythic level is simply not there since that series and her work is too caught up in its own plot machinery to make those sorts of suggestions, but like... of course Dumbledore is buried on the school grounds. It's where he lived and worked. It's a very different premise.

For Rey and indeed the Skywalkers the Lars Homestead makes sense. It's where Luke became Luke, and it's also where Anakin made his oath, where Shmi (the only Skywalker to remain corporeal it seems) is buried... et cetera. The trauma of the site is part of the power, in which case I point you no further than Canterbury which would have probably been the last place on earth Becket would have wanted to commemorate.
Aside from Obi-Wan being a goofy-ass name that on a story level would be a bizarre association to make rather than the more universal Ben, "Ben" is the catalyst who brings the OT heroes together, not the Clone Wars hero. "Ben" is the man who sacrifices himself for the OT heroes to escape the Death Star, and "Ben" is the name Luke uses to refer to him when he thinks of him fondly or in despair. It's only in the cold light of Yoda's death that Luke ever calls him "Obi-Wan". It's not like Aragorn as well, there's not some great unpackaging of this character as he reclaims a birthright. For the OT heroes, General Kenobi is as much a relic of the past as "Luke Skywalker, Jedi Master" is for the ST heroes until Crait.

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Demoph wrote:
January 2nd, 2020, 4:53 pm
#releasethejjcut is trending on twitter, lol. It's mostly based on some "source" that revealed what she/he thinks was cut and added by Disney.
https://twitter.com/kenobistan/status/1 ... 1443560449
I say #releastheboyegacut since he now seems even less happy with this than he was with the last jedi lol

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